Regarding the psychological costs of rejection, perhaps a way forward would be to make an active effort at decoupling the rejection of your work from the rejection of your personhood. I recently got a pitch rejected, and while I felt the same feelings you describe, I also was certain that I was still good at hanging out with my kids, fixing stuff around the house, etc. It’s easy to forget that our work is not the totality of who we are, especially in the internet age, where out twitter selves can become, for us, our real selves.
Yes, that is sage advice. Not so easy to do, however, for things that are truly a rejection of your person in some sense, such as jobs — your work is judged, but mostly in an abstract general way, and there's also your personal history, and how much fun you are to be around — and dating.
One idea for the gatekeepers who can no longer scale to provide feedback to everyone: Provide feedback to a limited number of people, chosen at random (with potential prioritization for those who were close to the threshold).
This can be explicitly mentioned in the rejection letter: "We are unable to provide individualized feedback to everyone unfortunately, but we do so for a randomized 10% of candidates. You were [not] selected in this 10%", followed by the feedback if they were selected.
I like it. Doing it at random (and explicitly saying so) would perhaps shift the focus from "I'm not even good enough to get feedback" to "Okay, they have limited resources, I understand."
As an M.A. with some sweet paid university-lecturer level jobs 2002-2017, and now a part-time member of the nightwatch*: I agree.
I agree, nay empathise, with most of your post very much. Still, Tyler Cowen and other gatekeepers are not in the biz of ambition maximising, but selecting for grants/jobs. As for how much ambition is in this world, applying is worse than a zero-sum-game. But don't we all start out over-ambitious? See: Forer statement No.12: "Some of your aspirations tend to be pretty unrealistic." https://www.astralcodexten.com/p/forer-statements-as-updates-and-affirmations
I'm not sure that we all start out too ambitious? Maybe as naïve children. But it feels that it's hammered out of many of us very early on, such that for all our conscious life we feel it would be unbecoming to ask too much
Oh, you went to school, too? - I dunno; at 15, my dream job was "minister of defense". The urge to become alpha or get a letter up in the alpha-beta ... - omega - at least not to go down - is deeply ingrained in us social primates. Robin Hanson might say, it defines us.
Having been rejected from several competitive positions I really wanted, I deeply resonated with the sinking feeling of disappointment. Feeling delusional. Tempted to lower my ambition, settle.
I struggle to disaggregate setting my sights high (“I want this great job”) with ego/hubris (not willing to take a job I think is below me).
Funny enough, after a few full-time job rejections I spent months on, respectively, I gave up. Decided not to get a full time job after graduating university and lean into writing more fully and see where it takes me. It’s a different type of ambition with its own set of challenges.
While I generally agree with you, I think this essay understates how much easier certain types of rejection are than others. A lot of people embrace the lottery ticket theory of rejection — it doesn't cost me anything to try/apply, and perhaps something wonderful will happen if I do. This approach, at least for me, led me to under-invest in experiencing rejections that actually required a lot of effort and investment, which I think is much more important to push yourself towards as the likelihood and prospect of reward are far greater.
Hey there, I didn't liked your post. (In this moment I'm rejecting you only if you think so. On my mind I simply didn't like the post)
I have been rejected many times, in dating, jobs, meetings, etc. But I didn't expect a better feedback. For me it doesn't matter what does the other person believe. I will keep improving myself up, and keep trying for me.
Rocky Balboa said: "The world ain't all sunshine and rainbows. It is a very mean and nasty place It will beat you to your knees and keep you there permanently if you let it. You, me or nobody is going to hit as hard as life. But it ain't about how hard you hit, it is about how hard you can get hit and keep moving forward, how much can you take and keep moving forward. That's how winning is done!"
Why somebody should tell you that you have potential? It doesn't matter what he thinks about you.
The thing that matters it what you think about you.
Most people are weak, and fragile mentally. Waiting for others to believe in them so they could believe in them (90% of the people)
The work is inwards no outwards. If we have to give feedback everytime we choose something. We should tell everytime the Cookie, that she isn't good enough to share with my coffee, but she still is a good Cookie for someone else. But this time I will choose the Brownie because it fix better with my coffee.
Thanks for your input! It's true that the world is a nasty place—but you'll note that my post at least suggests that we make it actually less nasty. That would be a positive thing, I think. Even if we can get used to the nastiness, it doesn't mean that the nastiness is itself good.
I'm happy if it doesn't matter to you what others think of you. It looks like you have found a way to deal with rejection. But not everyone has managed to do that, and as a result there's so much wasted potential.
Regarding the psychological costs of rejection, perhaps a way forward would be to make an active effort at decoupling the rejection of your work from the rejection of your personhood. I recently got a pitch rejected, and while I felt the same feelings you describe, I also was certain that I was still good at hanging out with my kids, fixing stuff around the house, etc. It’s easy to forget that our work is not the totality of who we are, especially in the internet age, where out twitter selves can become, for us, our real selves.
Yes, that is sage advice. Not so easy to do, however, for things that are truly a rejection of your person in some sense, such as jobs — your work is judged, but mostly in an abstract general way, and there's also your personal history, and how much fun you are to be around — and dating.
Quite true. Dating is an especially good example.
One idea for the gatekeepers who can no longer scale to provide feedback to everyone: Provide feedback to a limited number of people, chosen at random (with potential prioritization for those who were close to the threshold).
This can be explicitly mentioned in the rejection letter: "We are unable to provide individualized feedback to everyone unfortunately, but we do so for a randomized 10% of candidates. You were [not] selected in this 10%", followed by the feedback if they were selected.
I like it. Doing it at random (and explicitly saying so) would perhaps shift the focus from "I'm not even good enough to get feedback" to "Okay, they have limited resources, I understand."
That sting of rejection, "that sting is pride (f_) with you. (F_) pride!" Pulp fiction https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ruhFmBrl4GM
As an M.A. with some sweet paid university-lecturer level jobs 2002-2017, and now a part-time member of the nightwatch*: I agree.
I agree, nay empathise, with most of your post very much. Still, Tyler Cowen and other gatekeepers are not in the biz of ambition maximising, but selecting for grants/jobs. As for how much ambition is in this world, applying is worse than a zero-sum-game. But don't we all start out over-ambitious? See: Forer statement No.12: "Some of your aspirations tend to be pretty unrealistic." https://www.astralcodexten.com/p/forer-statements-as-updates-and-affirmations
* as Dennis Hopper in True Romance https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6_G7-opxBLQ
I'm not sure that we all start out too ambitious? Maybe as naïve children. But it feels that it's hammered out of many of us very early on, such that for all our conscious life we feel it would be unbecoming to ask too much
Oh, you went to school, too? - I dunno; at 15, my dream job was "minister of defense". The urge to become alpha or get a letter up in the alpha-beta ... - omega - at least not to go down - is deeply ingrained in us social primates. Robin Hanson might say, it defines us.
Really enjoyed this Étienne.
Having been rejected from several competitive positions I really wanted, I deeply resonated with the sinking feeling of disappointment. Feeling delusional. Tempted to lower my ambition, settle.
I struggle to disaggregate setting my sights high (“I want this great job”) with ego/hubris (not willing to take a job I think is below me).
Funny enough, after a few full-time job rejections I spent months on, respectively, I gave up. Decided not to get a full time job after graduating university and lean into writing more fully and see where it takes me. It’s a different type of ambition with its own set of challenges.
Thank you for sharing :)
Thank you for reading :) Best of luck in writing, and I hope you remain ambitious in whatever way is most meaningful to you!
Hi Etienne,
While I generally agree with you, I think this essay understates how much easier certain types of rejection are than others. A lot of people embrace the lottery ticket theory of rejection — it doesn't cost me anything to try/apply, and perhaps something wonderful will happen if I do. This approach, at least for me, led me to under-invest in experiencing rejections that actually required a lot of effort and investment, which I think is much more important to push yourself towards as the likelihood and prospect of reward are far greater.
Hey there, I didn't liked your post. (In this moment I'm rejecting you only if you think so. On my mind I simply didn't like the post)
I have been rejected many times, in dating, jobs, meetings, etc. But I didn't expect a better feedback. For me it doesn't matter what does the other person believe. I will keep improving myself up, and keep trying for me.
Rocky Balboa said: "The world ain't all sunshine and rainbows. It is a very mean and nasty place It will beat you to your knees and keep you there permanently if you let it. You, me or nobody is going to hit as hard as life. But it ain't about how hard you hit, it is about how hard you can get hit and keep moving forward, how much can you take and keep moving forward. That's how winning is done!"
Why somebody should tell you that you have potential? It doesn't matter what he thinks about you.
The thing that matters it what you think about you.
Most people are weak, and fragile mentally. Waiting for others to believe in them so they could believe in them (90% of the people)
The work is inwards no outwards. If we have to give feedback everytime we choose something. We should tell everytime the Cookie, that she isn't good enough to share with my coffee, but she still is a good Cookie for someone else. But this time I will choose the Brownie because it fix better with my coffee.
Thanks for your input! It's true that the world is a nasty place—but you'll note that my post at least suggests that we make it actually less nasty. That would be a positive thing, I think. Even if we can get used to the nastiness, it doesn't mean that the nastiness is itself good.
I'm happy if it doesn't matter to you what others think of you. It looks like you have found a way to deal with rejection. But not everyone has managed to do that, and as a result there's so much wasted potential.
Got you! You have a point there!
Rocky Speech: https://youtu.be/_J0Ahh3UxbM
> Sure, that would probably require more gatekeepers. Then let’s hire more!
No, lets not do that...
Haha it felt weird when I wrote it, but I think it should be pretty clear that we wouldn't be increasing the number of *gates*!